Security

[infringer]

there has to be a way to create a true endpoint to endpoint encryption system... securing the users IP numbers by encrypting them in a secure transfer for one.
This can be achived through a method like ants P2P using an ID number which changes everytime upon connection.

Another thing needed is the file sent also needs to be not known.
A way to do this is to database all links to files in movie type should be named externally as HomeMovieXXXXXXXX the xxxxx being its true name encrypted from prying eyes and returned unencryptable by anyone but the user who requests the movie as its being relayed through the network and for Music SongIwroteXXXXXXXX xxx being the encrypted and so on through the listing of applications then that way as the information is being relayed it will simply look as if it were a home movie being requested from another peer along with some personal refernce numbers or a song and so forth. No proof is then left for anyone to be accused of downloading nothing copywrighted.

The file being searched for should not come up from a particular IP as well.
Which can be used as an encrypted IP in some way the decentralized network must only know your ID number which is given and not relay your true IP.

The file sharing network itself must remain decentralized that way no one can take the fall.

All authors of filesharing software should use one alias such as "Blank" and remain anonymous and never place there name to it.

Security of the program should be challanged on a normal basis and the integrity of the the program being downloaded should be documented in size and revision. Then that way people dont release knock offs of your program with patched backdoors for folks.

Annomity is the only way to win the true battel with the annomity of file sharers on the network it will make it tough enough for anyone to be convicted and then with the annomity of what files being sent or relayed through the server to you upon search, download or send that would put a hex on them working with ISP's to monitor filetransfers by name flowing through the pipe making it a very difficult task for anyone to track or prove that the piracy took place without the physical evidence.

Finally folks who share files should own external hard drives to share and keep there files on. And do away with there data on there main drive considered by some to be infringing in an encrypted manner of deletion.

-infringer-

[Undying Wizard NHD]

you sure like to type dont you LOL

[infringer]

I dunno what it is but in order to clarify my views I find it nessacary to be as descriptive as possible.

But yes I have been told I have some of the longest informitive posts at other board I used to visit and moderate as well.

You are not the first to notice that one ;)

Have a good one and thx for the complement if it was one !

Good luck on staying on the straight and narrow as well.

-infringer-

[Afn]

there has to be a way to create a true endpoint to endpoint encryption system... securing the users IP numbers by encrypting them in a secure transfer for one.
This can be achived through a method like ants P2P using an ID number which changes everytime upon connection.

In theory, I proposed that you could have a chart of all the possible combinations of a 1k block. You read a file, write a text file pointing to the right 1k block. Since your trading key files and not real files, in theory a copy has not been made.

The people that tell you "copy bad", are the same people that want to sell you stuff. "Our copy is good. Good for you. Buy it. Good. Yum." So anyone selling copies to create a living, (while other people are prevented from making enough money to live in wealth, another story for another time), Is going to want to stop the culture that will lead to the end of selling copies of stuff in exchange for payment.

Money and payment are also a social system, the last time I was in the wilderness, I did not see a bear ask before he drank my beer, or a wolf permission to use my computer.

In reality, it is a social system, and social systems need to get whacked, and the people selling bits for a living are going to get a big whack when information becomes valueless as automation and technology advance.

Gahndi knew the system and exploited the flaws of the system against the british to seek independent rule of india. The weakness of the copyright system is that it is based on restriction of information for profiteering.

I would like to see a content pool structure. This will pay the artists. If the government runs the system, the artists will be paid, and the people that are in the industry will have to retire, get compensated by the government or find other work.

A content pool system is not the best of all worlds, but it will work a hell of alot better than our current system. When information drops to near zero value because of glut and connected computer systems, a content pool will stablize the value of information work and allow artists compensation for creating works of art, and a system that allows the content to flow to those who need and want it AND serving the public with an always on, high bandwith internet that delivers a true multimedia experience.

[cpugeniusmv]

there has to be a way to create a true endpoint to endpoint encryption system... securing the users IP numbers by encrypting them in a secure transfer for one.
This can be achived through a method like ants P2P using an ID number which changes everytime upon connection.

with the current internet, if/when you connect directly to another computer, it doesn't matter how much you've encrypted your information, the IP of the other computer can be resolved. sure, proxies can be used, or it can be routed through other computers, but realize that most residential broadband has crappy upload speeds, and this can't perform as well as its insecure competitors.

Another thing needed is the file sent also needs to be not known.
A way to do this is to database all links to files in movie type should be named externally as HomeMovieXXXXXXXX the xxxxx being its true name encrypted from prying eyes and returned unencryptable by anyone but the user who requests the movie as its being relayed through the network and for Music SongIwroteXXXXXXXX xxx being the encrypted and so on through the listing of applications then that way as the information is being relayed it will simply look as if it were a home movie being requested from another peer along with some personal refernce numbers or a song and so forth. No proof is then left for anyone to be accused of downloading nothing copywrighted.

there's no reason to do this, if a [RI | MP]AA member gets on the network, he could have the same access as any other user.

The file being searched for should not come up from a particular IP as well.
Which can be used as an encrypted IP in some way the decentralized network must only know your ID number which is given and not relay your true IP.

at some point in the network there has to be some translation from "ID number" to IP for a file transfer to take place. oops.

The file sharing network itself must remain decentralized that way no one can take the fall.

i have nothing to say about that; that's been done.

All authors of filesharing software should use one alias such as "Blank" and remain anonymous and never place there name to it.

obviously

Security of the program should be challanged on a normal basis and the integrity of the the program being downloaded should be documented in size and revision. Then that way people dont release knock offs of your program with patched backdoors for folks.

that's really up to the end user.

Annomity is the only way to win the true battel with the annomity of file sharers on the network it will make it tough enough for anyone to be convicted and then with the annomity of what files being sent or relayed through the server to you upon search, download or send that would put a hex on them working with ISP's to monitor filetransfers by name flowing through the pipe making it a very difficult task for anyone to track or prove that the piracy took place without the physical evidence.

it may be the only way to "win", but it's also very nearly impossible. for complete anonymity to happen, the TCP/IP protocol would need to be completely redesigned with this in mind...even then it would be relatively difficult, and i doubt it would be done for this particular reason (read: money).

Finally folks who share files should own external hard drives to share and keep there files on. And do away with there data on there main drive considered by some to be infringing in an encrypted manner of deletion.

-infringer-

external drives, internal drives...what's the difference? are you going to disconnect your drives and hide them every time someone knocks on the door?

[infringer]

CPUGENIUS,

OK so what you are saying is that encryption will not decrease my chances of being caught downloading a copywrighted work off of a P2P network by a long shot. And you believe that the security and encryption that a network provides like ants is worthless and useless to put it in a blunt manner?

Last time I checked this is not true there are forums of encryption which have still not been able to be broken that were around from 1976 I believe it was when good old RSA encryption algo came along.

Ok so maybe what you are saying holds true to a certain extent folks will get caught no matter what they do but... admit it the more obsticles that you place in the way of someone persuing you the less chance you have of being caught. Thats just common sense.

To be realistic I would rather be on a somewhat secure system then on some system when my information is transfered everytime I get pinged for a file that my IP shows up.... There has got to be a way to route the information through a number of users so that the only person that can decrypt the information is the person sending or reciviing while keeping there ip anonymous as well. It would be a network relaying stuff in tunnels basically but as well as keeping folks from looking at whats being transfered in your tunnel the point from which the information originates from is kept unknown as well.

I dunno I have faith in annoymous p2p ventures though many people here dont maybe its because I was one of the few from here that was banned by there ISP.... And I used to think the same way as many ahhhh they'll never get me or ahhh security who needs it whats the point of being annoymous now I realize that my thinking was a bit shallow.

-infringer-

[method]

Anyone think it'd be possible to spoof the IP address in UDP packet headers??

I'm just thinking... if you made a p2p app function so that responses to search-query-broadcasts were verified by a third-party peer (to keep a track on whether a user has the file/file-segment available and is willing to respond/send the data requested)... the first user to respond positively to the query then sends the data via UDP protocol with a spoofed IP address in the headers.

This way the correct data still gets received without exposing the real IP address in the UDP packets and avoids the slow-down that relaying data through a third-party peer would cause. (The most common and viable anonymity technqiue so far) - The spoofed IP could also be relayed by the third-party peer back to the query-making peer - so that it knows to acknowledge UDP data sent by that fake IP address.

This idea is completely theoretical as I'm not 100% sure on whether there's anything used to verify the IP-address in UDP packet headers. There's also the fact that this would only be viable for direct connections (no passively-connecting, routered or networked users could receive files this way.) - But for all other users (the majority) it might be possible, I don't see why not... anyone know?

[crackerjacker]

Anyone think it'd be possible to spoof the IP address in UDP packet headers??

I'm just thinking... if you made a p2p app function so that responses to search-query-broadcasts were verified by a third-party peer (to keep a track on whether a user has the file/file-segment available and is willing to respond/send the data requested)... the first user to respond positively to the query then sends the data via UDP protocol with a spoofed IP address in the headers.

This way the correct data still gets received without exposing the real IP address in the UDP packets and avoids the slow-down that relaying data through a third-party peer would cause. (The most common and viable anonymity technqiue so far) - The spoofed IP could also be relayed by the third-party peer back to the query-making peer - so that it knows to acknowledge UDP data sent by that fake IP address.

This idea is completely theoretical as I'm not 100% sure on whether there's anything used to verify the IP-address in UDP packet headers. There's also the fact that this would only be viable for direct connections (no passively-connecting, routered or networked users could receive files this way.) - But for all other users (the majority) it might be possible, I don't see why not... anyone know?

hi method
this seems interesting.

[cpugeniusmv]

CPUGENIUS,

OK so what you are saying is that encryption will not decrease my chances of being caught downloading a copywrighted work off of a P2P network by a long shot. And you believe that the security and encryption that a network provides like ants is worthless and useless to put it in a blunt manner?

Last time I checked this is not true there are forums of encryption which have still not been able to be broken that were around from 1976 I believe it was when good old RSA encryption algo came along.

Ok so maybe what you are saying holds true to a certain extent folks will get caught no matter what they do but... admit it the more obsticles that you place in the way of someone persuing you the less chance you have of being caught. Thats just common sense.

To be realistic I would rather be on a somewhat secure system then on some system when my information is transfered everytime I get pinged for a file that my IP shows up.... There has got to be a way to route the information through a number of users so that the only person that can decrypt the information is the person sending or reciviing while keeping there ip anonymous as well. It would be a network relaying stuff in tunnels basically but as well as keeping folks from looking at whats being transfered in your tunnel the point from which the information originates from is kept unknown as well.

I dunno I have faith in annoymous p2p ventures though many people here dont maybe its because I was one of the few from here that was banned by there ISP.... And I used to think the same way as many ahhhh they'll never get me or ahhh security who needs it whats the point of being annoymous now I realize that my thinking was a bit shallow.

-infringer-

i'm not saying that encryption is worthless, i'm saying that the TCP/IP protocol always shows the IP address of other computers you are connected to, no matter how much your data is encrypted. i'm also saying that if a member of the MPAA (or RIAA, take your pick) had the same priveleges as you on this network, (keep in mind i'm not talking about routing transfers through other nodes at this point), they would be able to obtain your IP.

in response to routing transfers through other nodes: yeah, it would work. it would be very difficult to get an IP address of a user in this type of situation, but what i was trying to say is that it would also be very slow in comparison to direct transfers on other competing p2p networks.

Anyone think it'd be possible to spoof the IP address in UDP packet headers??

I'm just thinking... if you made a p2p app function so that responses to search-query-broadcasts were verified by a third-party peer (to keep a track on whether a user has the file/file-segment available and is willing to respond/send the data requested)... the first user to respond positively to the query then sends the data via UDP protocol with a spoofed IP address in the headers.

This way the correct data still gets received without exposing the real IP address in the UDP packets and avoids the slow-down that relaying data through a third-party peer would cause. (The most common and viable anonymity technqiue so far) - The spoofed IP could also be relayed by the third-party peer back to the query-making peer - so that it knows to acknowledge UDP data sent by that fake IP address.

This idea is completely theoretical as I'm not 100% sure on whether there's anything used to verify the IP-address in UDP packet headers. There's also the fact that this would only be viable for direct connections (no passively-connecting, routered or networked users could receive files this way.) - But for all other users (the majority) it might be possible, I don't see why not... anyone know?

the only problem i see with that is that i believe there are many routers on the internet that can detect, and drop packets that spoof IPs. that would cause a few problems. (i'm not an expert on TCP and UDP transmissions, or routing, so don't hold me to that)

[Stownplayer]

I don't pretend to be a very technical user but how do you spoof your ip address? I would love to research that.

[cpugeniusmv]

I don't pretend to be a very technical user but how do you spoof your ip address? I would love to research that.

http://www.google.com/search?q=ip%20...ie=UTF-8&hl=en

again, it is detectable.

[method]

XP supports raw-sockets... allowing you to create TCP/UDP header packets with a spoofed IP.

IP spoofing isn't exactly as "leet" as it used to be either!! :)

[Watchmen]

XP supports raw-sockets... allowing you to create TCP/UDP header packets with a spoofed IP.

IP spoofing isn't exactly as "leet" as it used to be either!! :)

Not my field of expertise...but wouldn't spoofed 'return addresses' be useless in a p2p type environment...I can't think of any practical applications for doing so in the first place legal or otherwise.

[eivioolla]

Anyone think it'd be possible to spoof the IP address in UDP packet headers??

I'm just thinking... if you made a p2p app function so that responses to search-query-broadcasts were verified by a third-party peer (to keep a track on whether a user has the file/file-segment available and is willing to respond/send the data requested)... the first user to respond positively to the query then sends the data via UDP protocol with a spoofed IP address in the headers.

This way the correct data still gets received without exposing the real IP address in the UDP packets and avoids the slow-down that relaying data through a third-party peer would cause. (The most common and viable anonymity technqiue so far) - The spoofed IP could also be relayed by the third-party peer back to the query-making peer - so that it knows to acknowledge UDP data sent by that fake IP address.

This idea is completely theoretical as I'm not 100% sure on whether there's anything used to verify the IP-address in UDP packet headers. There's also the fact that this would only be viable for direct connections (no passively-connecting, routered or networked users could receive files this way.) - But for all other users (the majority) it might be possible, I don't see why not... anyone know?

It was done, the project was called SUMI but never got further than alpha/beta. I managed to download a test file from the test server and every incoming packet had a different IP. :) On the other hand our network is configred so that packets with an address that does not belong to the subnet will be dropped -> spoofed sends not possible.

http://sumi.sourceforge.net/

[eivioolla]

the only problem i see with that is that i believe there are many routers on the internet that can detect, and drop packets that spoof IPs. that would cause a few problems. (i'm not an expert on TCP and UDP transmissions, or routing, so don't hold me to that)

It's not so much routers on the way (they can't know where the packet is originally coming from) but it's the border gateways that you're first connected to at your ISP. There it's easy to see whether a packet with a certain IP can really be coming from the subnet and drop it if not.