Theft?

[gamingjammer]

A bit to read: Hopefully you can spare the time:

I wanted to load my bands music into the xbox hard drive to listen to while gaming. To me that seems fair use but I think gaming musicians don't comprise too much of the gaming population. So I guess I'm screwed out of that freedom to choose by piracy protection. Don't get me wrong, Bill Gatesatan and Microshite are EVIL, but as a musician that has 3 releases out, I CAN'T FATHOM the outrage some of you people express at NOT BEING ABLE TO ENJOY YOUR INALIEABLE RIGHT TO STEAL! Everyone talks about how great the PS sold, due in large part to mods. Most manufacturers, in business to make a buck, not provide you spoiled kids with "FREE" entertainment, would say: "Whoopty Shit" Selling a console is not a money making venture, the software is. If enough of you steal software to the point wher making a console becomes a LOSING proposition, NO ONE will bother. THEN what will you game on if there are NO software developers left who can make a living?!?!
Ask yourself this: How would you like to have one of you who claim it's your RIGHT to have it free, walk into the place where you work each week and take your pay check out of your hand on pay day? When you rip a game or cd, you screw regular smucks like you and me who work for a living out of a pay check. If a development house has it's software stolen, they lose profit and people get laid off or LOSE their jobs. Would YOU dig this stealing if it cost you your job? As an independent musician, the prospect of spending $1000's of MY cash to put out another cd which no one would pay for when it's FREE, makes me doubt I'll ever put out another. Is THAT fair? Bums me out. By selling a few thousand of our releases, it paid to do more. Can't see that happening with the mind-set now that "WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PAY".
To close this, I AGREE that software and music IS overpriced. Maybe if the greedy corporate bastards had started with lower, more reasonable prices back when cd came out, piracy wouldn't have taken off. Maybe if they tried that now, more of you would be LESS likely to thieve? Unfortunately, I doubt it.
I’m sending an email to the xbox weasles about my own fair use issue. I’d like to hear any of you justify your position, rants not wanted tho’. Gimme some valid reasons why theft is “ok” and a “right” Also leave me your home address so I can swing by your house and take a bunch of shit. I know you won’t mind.
Lemme know if you wanna see Microsoft’s (no doubt) bullshit response when/if it comes.

Think about it

Will B
PS: ASK ZEROPAID IF THEY WILL SEND YOU THE SHIRT THEY’RE ADVERSTISING FOR FREE! THEY SHOULD GIVE THEM TO YOU, RIGHT?!?!? BETCHA THEY TELL YOU TO GET BENT.
H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-E-S
:sw

[BlueLieu]

Wow, I never realized I was hurting anybody. I am a changed man, I will never share...I mean steal again!

I love it when you get this sort of tripe written by a user who just joined ZP and has one post (this one). But anyway, good luck gamingjammer, may the force be with you.

[cheapprick]

Not really an issue, this person joined for this post.

@ gamingjammer
You chose to post this at Zeropaid because of the name, right? What is P2P to you? Is it millions of people sitting around hoping to steal some starving artist's work? I'm guessing that you aren't losing any money to it. I could publish a killer release of my droning on for 2 hours, but nobody would download it. New music is being downloaded everyday, creating new fans of different genres everyday. My own music interests have varied greatly over the last 2 years. And whom should I turn to when looking for new talent, the RIAA? Nope, I'll turn to people I hear and trust talking about new music.

The only artists that I see as seriously in trouble due to P2P are those who sound like crap live. If you have made albums, you have probably noticed that the majority of your income is from actually playing. The same holds true for better established artists. And if instead those artists are actually a talentless, manufactured sound should I cry if nobody buys their cd?


Here's what I suggest to you. Download KazaaLite. Grab some great different music. Try to sound like that.

edit* I forgot the address.
24 Sussex Drive, Ottawa
Come get some.

[Sosua]

I have worked in the music business for more then 15 years and let me tell you that you are far away from the truth. First, where do you think most of the money goes when you by a CD??? Big portion of it goes for bying COCAINE to support the need of the artist. I have worked in studios and most of the artist are (sniffing coke) for most part of the recording time. It's part of the budget. Promotion reprensentative will pay for this. Also they pay for all the orgies that is going on troughout the years in different awards shows. Expensive cars, prostitutes, jewels, all kinds of gifts are also paid by the company. Once i was at the Billboard convention in N.Y and let me tell you that you would not beleive all the money that is spend there. You go from one orgies to another all night and this is all pay by the company. Think about it and you will find out that when you download music (illegally) from P2P you are taking away from the company and the artist : Expensives cars, COCAINE, lush life, jewelry, prostitutes, and all these orgies. Is this going to make me cry?? Never in a twousand years. The problem is that most of you dont know what is going on inside the music business, once you find out you will realise that you are not taking any food out of nobody's mouth. You are making it impossible for them to have all that shit.

Sorry for my english.

[cheapprick]

Good God, somebody find me an agent!

[SnakeAnarchy]

well gaming you have the wrong picture on p2p. Its not about getting something free, and stealing its about sharing and trying something out to see if you like it and then its up to you to buy it or do what you want. Like cheap i have changed m music taste since i started using p2p, I personaly buy the music i like that i get from kazaa, but i dont buy what i dont like. Now if we talk about the products of big corporations like microsoft software, a movie or a mainstream band then i dont give a fuck and dont buy it. I really dont care about giving more money to those who are already rich, i pay for the products of those who deserve it.

[notbob]

that was the classic RIAA troll

he'll never come back

he's no game music maker, he's a fat old 60 year old executive--notice his usage of the word "dig"

when was the last time you heard someone out of the music industry say "Man! I really dig that sound!"?

video game programmers are 25ish, they probably would have never even heard the word "dig" that way (unless they listened to Peter, Paul, and Mary, which i find highly unlikely)

[Sephiroth]

his first mistake was going with the halo-box.. Seriously everything else on xbox but halo is either allready on other consoles and are much better or just sucks.. Which is why Xbox isnt making money because one game isnt enough to get me to buy one.

The problem with the music industry today is relying on anicent practices..

The pushing of new restrictive formats and drm "solutions" and the total disrespect to music listeners and other questionable practices like price fixing and trying to use new formats and etc to further inflate the price of music.

Also the "manufactured" "artists" whose music is entirely sampled from older artists and they just either resing or sing new words and try to project some image.. Music is music its not just the "image" and people are tired of hearing the same old pop mtv shit from airhead bimbos dressed up like a street whore..

Plus the constant using of P2P as the industry scape goat which is why this person is just blaming P2P and everyone here for all their problems and its been happening for a long time and will probably continue to happen a long time.

[gamingjammer]

First, I'm not a fat 60 year old record weasle suit. I came out a few weeks after Sgt. Pepper, ('67 if your not a Beatles fan), and am generally taken for a 23-24 years old (good genes, avoided sun for the last 15 years). Never said I did game music either. Unfortunately no one gave any evidence to oppose my facts other than aggressive putdowns. Why is it so bad that this is my first post?? Did all of you automatically start with your 10th or 20th?!?! Other than a few infantile knee jerk responses, you folks have raised some valid points, many of which I agree with.
Now I'll respond:
I'm definitely NOT a fan of RIAA, they're a bunch of money grabbing whores who have turned the music business into a bland "industry".
It appears most if not all of you did not fully read my post: I suggested that the weasles have OVER CHARGED for their "product" - hate that word- trying to make BILLIONS when millions should suffice. There is a lot of waste though I doubt as much of it goes to coke as 'Scarface' suggested. The fact that Joe Retailer makes more that the lable OR artist needs to be looked at too.
I noticed that EVERY one of you zeroed in on the music aspect of my post. I agree that checking out an album before you BUY IS GOOD. Maybe the lables will stop releasing dreck filled albums. I do use Kazaa lite for that very purpose: I BOUGHT QOTSA, Audioslave, and the new Peter Gabriel by using it. But mayne cuz I'm a little older, I believe in supporting these artists, even if their whoring masters are still taking too big a piece. I notice that younger folks, while seemingly oblivious to what QUALITY sound is, (an mp3-no matter the sample rate doesn't cut it), actually BELIEVE it is their RIGHT to have free shit!
You can't debate the fact that last year was the first year tha CDR sales SURPASSED comercial cd release sales so the arguement there isn't enough to buy that's good shit, or at the least popular, doesn't wash either. OBVIOUSLY MANY people are NOT doing the honourable thing as you suggest and buying music/games they like. Theft is cheaper.
I also notice none of you touch the issue of game piracy. NO ONE in any of the posts I've read on this site gives any suggestion that they go out and buy games, "I'll take what I want because I deserve it." seems to be the credo.
I actually hit this site looking on google for some xbox shit for a friend so that trumps the suggestion made that I hit this site because of it's name.. I don't own an x-barge, I borrowed my guitar player's. I don't care if it makes pizza, I'll not support Gates.
BTW: Any of you hit up the site owners for your free shirts yet?
Isn't it a little OBVIOUS to any of you the LEVEL of hypocrisy in a site that extolls file "SHARING" won't "SHARE" their shirts with all of you? If you like it, they KNOW you'll forward payment. Wontcha?
It's pretty obvious that the greed of the suits we all love to hate has trickled down.
Pritty Shitty.

:devil

[notbob]

as for t-shirts -- they posted the template for gods sake, if anyone wanted to they could print up 100 of them

maybe nobody takes you seriously because

a)your first post was a moralistic rant telling us how naughty we are

b)you called us all theives without even knowing us

c)your gross overuse of caps and exclaimation points

go ahead pay for music that's fine by me--i won't try and stop you

thats what the man wants you to do right?

a cd is 17 bucks where i come from--a musician gets 80 cents (tops) that leaves 16.20 not going to the artist

by my math it looks like the RIAA is hurting the artist way worse than i ever could, (and they are losing a lot more than the artist)

so i say fuck em! i bought over 900 cds--i call this payback--ain't it a bitch?

[cheapprick]

I don't know, they sent me a shirt. They said good job, keep spouting off in the forums, we know you are always on the mark.

The games issue I imagine wasn't addessed because a great number of people only use filetrading for musical interests. There are lots of games out there I suppose, but not every filetrader is the same.

Can I point out that you referred to the fact that MP3's are not the same quality as the original? That was an interesting point. If I kicked in the door of the Louvre, used my EXTREME physical skills to dodge the coppers and escaped with the Mona Lisa that would truly be theft. To turn around and sell it would certainly be a crime. However, if I sit right here at my house and paint a copy and give it away, is that still a crime?

I haven't hurt the original. I certainly didn't make anything of the same quality as the original. There would be no problem with me giving it away, correct? This may seem oversimplified, but this is exactly the way that I see sharing music files.

As for your point that people are not buying music at all, I would suggest to you that people are still buying quality artist's material hand-over-fist. It is the manufactured/glitz stars that are really being spanked.

While I'm on the subject of supporting worthwhile bands, my own humble city has a band called Wide Mouth Mason that I would encourage anyone to pick up one of their albums. Their primary songs such as Smile or Rained Out Parade are good, but they have a decent portfolio by now. And they just played for New Year's Eve in town.

[Ken17625]

I suggested that the weasles have OVER CHARGED for their "product"


Ok, i'll ignore the rest of your post. Its all irrelevant anyway. As stated above, you said the labels have over charged for their product. Well, what can consumers do about it? How can they influence the price of music without actually boycotting some music all together? For many years, they could do NOTHING!!! If you were around, i'm sure you seen the news article on ZP recently that talked about the price gauging of music and that people are entitled to retribution. But of course its only "up to" $20 and the hassle to actually recieve anything is not worth it.

This is where P2P comes in. P2P puts control of the music industry in the peoples hands. The RIAA can either lower prices to acceptible levels as they should or they can die a slow and painful death. Its all very simple. If you "don't like it", then tell that to someone who cares because I quite frankly don't.


Also leave me your home address so I can swing by your house and take a bunch of shit. I know you won’t mind.

Thats so funny I have trouble controlling my laughter. That also sounds oddly familiar. I thought I heard a "certain" metallica member say something like this as well. I'm sure you know who I mean. **wink, wink**

[Scyth77521]

Originally posted by gamingjammer
I don't own an x-barge, I borrowed my guitar player's.

Thief.

[Krell]

gamingjammer

You have two huge columns of constipation, and after all that, my response is "SO WHAT"

I'm a kleptomaniac too. Hows that for ya?

idiot

[overdo]

was this thread supposed to make every1 feel guilty?!??! i mean right now my conscience is turning over and over and i'm wondering how i'm going to live with myself. oh wait.... *sees fortunes of musicians and record labels* ..the guilt has passed now.

if albums cost £5 or $5 then i might feel bad, seeing as they aren't that price, i don't feel bad.

[nasrules]

overdo: yeh i agree with that its exactly wot the record co's should do

seph: lol!

gamingjammer: SOLUTION: get a ps2, vice city, mgs2, the getaway, a hifi and a cd burner. put the tracks on cd and listen to em on ur hifi well playin games that leave the xbox trailing