Creative player picks fight with iPod

[wessman]

Creative player picks fight with iPod
By John G. Spooner
Special to ZDNet News
October 14, 2002, 11:12 AM PT
URL: http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1103-961926.html
Creative Technology launched on Monday a new portable music player in an effort to keep Windows users from dancing with Apple Computer's iPod.

Creative's player, the Nomad Jukebox Zen MP3, will sell for $299 after a $50 mail-in rebate--less than Apple's comparable iPod music player that sells for $499.

In July, Apple introduced a Windows version of its iPod, which at 20GB can hold up to 4,000 songs in 160kbps MP3 files, or 5,200 songs in 128kbps files. The player began selling at retail Sept. 15.

Creative has countered with its player, which looks like a Sony Walkman. The Zen includes a 20GB hard drive, which lets it store up to 5,000 songs using 128kbps MP3 files, or 8,000 songs using Microsoft Windows Media Audio files.

Creative's 20GB machine is $50 less than Apple's lowest-end iPod, a 5GB machine that sells for $299.

The Zen's main selling points are its price and a Firewire connection, which lets it transfer data quickly to PCs that are not equipped with the latest version of Universal Serial Bus, USB 2.0.

However, Creative's use of a standard 2.5-inch hard drive could hamper sales for customers who are not necessarily shopping on price alone. Several manufacturers make 2.5-inch hard drives, which are standard for notebook PCs, while only one company, Toshiba, manufactures the 1.8-inch drive used in the iPod.

Because 2.5-inch drives are more readily available, they cost less. But the 2.5-inch drive makes the Zen bulkier than the iPod.

The Zen weighs 9.5 ounces and measures 4.5 inches by 3 inches and. The 20GB iPod weighs 7.2 ounces and measures 4 inches by 2.4 inches, making it potentially more appealing to people who care more about size and weight than about price.

Creative's player will be available from Amazon.com, Buy.com, Fry's Electronics, J&R Electronics and Cambridge SoundWorks, as well as directly from the company. Apple sells the iPod directly to customers. It is also available at Best Buy. :sw

[wesr]

personally, i would definately have to go with creative. i mean if u are that picky about the size.....cmon its only .5 by .6 inches bigger, and if u are that picky...then u have way too much money to go around and you need to share the wealth. i already have a nomad jukebox...its only 6 gigs, but i love it.....even tho its about the size of a cd player. it still fits my needs....so, dont be spoiled, get the nomad one

[wessman]

Another iPod Competitor
from the looks-worthy dept.
posted by timothy on Monday October 14, @15:45 (hardware)
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/10/14/199201

[0]rael9real writes "NOMAD has intoduced a [1]new player. It has USB 2 and FireWire (finally), and supports WMA and MP3. It has a 20GB drive like the high-end iPod, and supposedly holds more music because it supports WMA (though why someone would want to use WMA is beyond me). It *is* [2]cheaper than the iPod, though. Looks like a definite competitor. Maybe it'll drive iPod pricing down." Update: 10/14 21:21 GMT by [3]T: Note that the listed specs for the player mention only "USB," not USB 2.

Links:
0. mailto:[email protected]
1. http://www.nomadworld.com/products/Jukebox_Zen/
2. http://store.apple.com/
3. http://www.monkey.org/~timothy/ :sw

[fu(k]

i own a creative INSPIRE 5.1 Digital 5700. its a very impressive sound system 4 my computer. Works very good when playing games and watching movies.

Creative make fine products 4 sale, cheap and worthwhile!!

[nasrules]

Unless you own an iPod, you don't see the advantages. Lighter, smaller, easier to use, better looking. Yes, it's more expensive, but when you buy one you know you're getting the best.

[autiggertoo2005]

It's NOT cheaper...the 3rd Gen Ipod 10 GB is $299...and that's not with a rebate. And with their AAC encoding on Itunes, you can get 64 kb/s encoding that sounds quite decent, and like nasrules said...it's SO much better...my friend has a creative nomad 1st gen...and it's clunky and huge...the 3rd gen ipods are lighter than 2 CDs and SOOO easy to use and much better looking...

[nasrules]

Note the date of the original post.

[freeloaders]

hey i own an ipod. i just got my ipod last week 10 gig 3rd gen. no other mp3 can match the ipod in looks, style, and ease. and with the itune for windows its just installs automatic and it can store files, photos, phone number, and notes. i can also tranfer a whole album in less then 10 sec. most mp3 players can't do that.

and of course to all you ipod hater. dont be hatin cuz you can't afford one :D

[WE_DELIVER]

I ordered a refurbished iPod in september and still have not gotten a WORKING one....but when they do work, they are trully the best.

[origin]

I own an IPOD. I think it does all it needs to do and more. Apple pretty much is grabbing the moblile music community's attention now not only for mac users bu t the MS users can use it also(win). I got the 20 gig one it was $399 kinda expensive but it straight up 0wnz.

l8

[Malicious Intent]

hmmm, what happened to wessman?

[Ken17625]

I don't know, but it seems all these players cost way too much money.

[nasrules]

I've got an iPod too, 10gb, 2nd gen. It rocks, period.

[isus]

I've got an iPod too, 10gb, 2nd gen. It rocks, period.
me too... wehn cpugenius isn't stealing it, it's very nice. although i want a new one, one of the 3g's... i was thinking of selling it next summer when i get my powerbook so i can get the adc discounts on both the ipod and the powerbook.

[wonderboy2005]

me too... wehn cpugenius isn't stealing it, it's very nice. although i want a new one, one of the 3g's... i was thinking of selling it next summer when i get my powerbook so i can get the adc discounts on both the ipod and the powerbook.
muahah! guess who just got a 3rd gen 40GB ipod in the mail today? thats right, me! im a little ticked off though, because i had to order the usb 2 cable (no firewire ports), and they sent it via fedex ground. the ipod came today, but i have to wait til wednesday before i can actually use it because of the cord. still though, im extatic about it, because i have been without any sort of music playing device, short of my computer, for the past 3-4 months. when i opened it up, i couldn't believe how small it was. i cant wait til wednesday. maybe it will come tomarrow... my ipod was supposed to come tomarrow, and it came a day early. maybe the cord will too.

[shawners]

how much did you spend on it wonderboy?

[wonderboy2005]

ipod - $469 (student discount)
usb 2 cord - $17.10 (student discount)
tax - ~$31

this was my birthday/christmas gift from my parents. they will put $100 twords it for my BD and $100 twords it for Christmas. the rest i have to pay off in $20 monthly increments, no interest (they are my parents after all)

[isus]

hey, we're the same age!

happy bday!

lol.

although, i would have suggested signing your folks up for the adc, gotten their hardware discount, saved a lot of money on the ipod, and then when you go to college, open another adc account in your name, and get mac hardware at huge discounts too.

[wonderboy2005]

and get mac hardware at huge discounts too. other than the ipod, i dont really have much use for apple hardware. i suppose if i do go into graphic design (its either that or medicine) i will need to work with apple hardware... we'll see though. and isnt adc like $100 to sign up? i cant imagine that it would be worth it just to get one ipod and a usb 2 cable. btw, that cable didnt come today. i was hoping it would, but no. if it doesnt come tomarrow, i wont be happy. i have this beutiful white rectangular thing sitting on my desk and i cant use it all because of a stinking little cable. humph...

[isus]

lemme go see something...
i can get a 40 gig ipod for $399 with the apple discount, so when you add on the $99 to sign up, you save ONE WHOLE DOLLAR!

so i guess maybe you should just take the saving you can get when you buy a new dual 2ghz g5 ;)

[wonderboy2005]

lemme go see something...
i can get a 40 gig ipod for $399 with the apple discount, so when you add on the $99 to sign up, you save ONE WHOLE DOLLAR!

so i guess maybe you should just take the saving you can get when you buy a new dual 2ghz g5 ;)
actually, it would be more expensive for me to go that way, as i can get the student discount through apple, nocking off $31, down to $469. so in essence, id be loosing $30 going that way.

[elperro91]

I've got an Archos 20GB Jukebox Recorder...cost me $250 last summer, but when I last checked Amazon it was $180! I am really impressed with this unit...there's open source development on it to boot, an alternate firmware called Rockbox that has TONS of features and improvements...sound quality is superb...highly recommend to anyone in the market for a player.

[aboi]

im sorry to say but i choose ipod. apple store in san francisco open last saturday. i got me a 15 gig ipod. installing was a lil pain in the ass but i got it to work(just follow derictions). i gotta say i dont think i'll buy another brand mp3 player agian. i went from irock, to panasonic, sony, iriver, and 2 rio. none of them fits my needs. but the ipod did. boy i wish apple makes OSX for x86

oh yea.... steve you rule

[wingnut2600]

I recently purchased a 40GB Creative Nomad Zen Xtra... it is pretty damned sweet. It cost the same price as a mini ipod, yet has ten times the storage capacity, plus... I am not supporting a company that overcharges for everything and adds "i" to the front of every product that is just an adaptation of past technology...

[isus]

can i be the first to say "thanks for bringing up a thread started in '02"?

wingnut: the mini ipod and nomad are bot competitors. don't try to look all hot and intelligent by talking about 2 different types of players aimed at different people.

mini ipod: people who like small things and are about to pay $250 for a 512mb flash player.
nomad: hard drive based player, big.

o, and you pay for what you get. quality-wise, the ipod beats the nomad hands down.

[wingnut2600]

o, and you pay for what you get. quality-wise, the ipod beats the nomad hands down.

Why exactly? Since it has an address book and solitaire?

I can change my battery (!) and a Nomad battery charge lasts for 12-14 hours in comparison to the ipod's 8 hours. My player sounds beautiful... especially w/ new headphones :)

You are just buying in to Apple hype... why is the ipod always the best for mindless Apple fanboys? There are many other viable contenders, but they are just not marketed as aggressively and given the same "geek chic."

I am glad that you are still towing the party line isus...

:fire
(The frog hates Apple even more than I do... an impressive feat to say the least)

[wonderboy2005]

i dont think that i am a fanboy by any means, but i still love my ipod. sure, it does have some downsides like its expense and the battery problem, but it also has some good points too. for example, ive never had an audio device that sounded as good as it does. if i ever do get around to it, i want to get a pair of grato SR60's to accompany it. the looks arent bad either. i realize that for many people, this is not a real big issue. i didnt think it would be either, but it is a chick magnet. for some reason, girls seem to love it, and ill take all the help i can get.

the problems that the ipod has werent really that big of a deal to me. my parents paid for almost half of it, so the expense wasnt that bad. and the battery has yet to let me down when i wanted to use it. i know that eventually i will have to replace it, but by then my warranty will probably be out, and i dont think ill have a problem with doing surgury on my ipod in such an event.

[isus]

Why exactly? Since it has an address book and solitaire?

I can change my battery (!) and a Nomad battery charge lasts for 12-14 hours in comparison to the ipod's 8 hours. My player sounds beautiful... especially w/ new headphones :)

You are just buying in to Apple hype... why is the ipod always the best for mindless Apple fanboys? There are many other viable contenders, but they are just not marketed as aggressively and given the same "geek chic."

I am glad that you are still towing the party line isus...

:fire
(The frog hates Apple even more than I do... an impressive feat to say the least)
hmm, apple fanboys? since when did 30% of the mp3 player buying population become fanboys?

oh, and you want a longer battery life from your ipod? build it yourself.
http://drewperry.co.uk/index.php?do=iPod&ipod=battery

battery doesn't last long enough?
buy one, grow some balls, and fix it.
ipodbattery.com

and the frog thing: real intelligent... moron.

[wonderboy2005]

hmm, apple fanboys? since when did 30% of the mp3 player buying population become fanboys?

oh, and you want a longer battery life from your ipod? build it yourself.
http://drewperry.co.uk/index.php?do=iPod&ipod=battery

battery doesn't last long enough?
buy one, grow some balls, and fix it.
ipodbattery.com

and the frog thing: real intelligent... moron.
settle down isus... he does have a valid point. the ipod costs alot more and has a lot less of a battery life. if somone is really concerned with battery life, they arent going to go out and buy a more expensive ipod, only to produce their own makeshift battery pack to fit their needs. especially when there is a cheaper player out there that has a longer battery life.

it all depends on what an individual wants out of a player. isus, you and i determined that the ipod met our needs and was worthwhile. if somone else determines that the ipod doesnt meet their needs or is too costly, so be it.

imagine what the world would be like if everyone wanted the same thing. only one type of car. only one operating system. only one color for your house. you get the picture... it just wouldnt be cool.

[wingnut2600]

imagine what the world would be like if everyone wanted the same thing. only one type of car. only one operating system. only one color for your house. you get the picture... it just wouldnt be cool.

I totally agree Wonderboy2005... I wasn't going to say anything after your first post, even though I wanted to clear up that I was not lumping you in as a fanboy (that was aimed at isus, who isn't just a fanboy but a mindless troll). I can see why yourself and others would buy ipods.

I think the ipod is pretty cool, but I also think that it costs too much and there are comparable products (albeit not with the "cool" or "hip" factor of the ipod) at a much lower price point. Choice is a good thing...

:fire
(The frog is hurt that you called wingnut a moron)

[nyvocals]

Nomad for sure...don't belive the hype. Ipod is over priced. A 30 Gig Creative is comparable and comes with a case for 249.00.

[aboi]

Why exactly? Since it has an address book and solitaire?

I can change my battery (!) and a Nomad battery charge lasts for 12-14 hours in comparison to the ipod's 8 hours. My player sounds beautiful... especially w/ new headphones :)

You are just buying in to Apple hype... why is the ipod always the best for mindless Apple fanboys? There are many other viable contenders, but they are just not marketed as aggressively and given the same "geek chic."

I am glad that you are still towing the party line isus...

:fire
(The frog hates Apple even more than I do... an impressive feat to say the least)


hey 8 to 10 hours of battery life is enough. if you gonna listen to music 12 to 14 hours straight. you must be a very lonley person and needs to get out more.

oh yeah, hands down lol

[isus]

I totally agree Wonderboy2005... I wasn't going to say anything after your first post, even though I wanted to clear up that I was not lumping you in as a fanboy (that was aimed at isus, who isn't just a fanboy but a mindless troll). I can see why yourself and others would buy ipods.

I think the ipod is pretty cool, but I also think that it costs too much and there are comparable products (albeit not with the "cool" or "hip" factor of the ipod) at a much lower price point. Choice is a good thing...

:fire
(The frog is hurt that you called wingnut a moron)
yea, mindless troll. you're the one sitting here talking the big talk about "buying in to apple hype" and "mindless fanboys". all i said was that the mini and the nomad are not comparable. their targets are completely different.

the mini is for intelligent folk who want a small mp3 player. the nomad is for morons like you who don't like apple.

:fire
(the frog doesn't give a shit. wingnut is a moron.)

[wonderboy2005]

yea, mindless troll. you're the one sitting here talking the big talk about "buying in to apple hype" and "mindless fanboys". all i said was that the mini and the nomad are not comparable. their targets are completely different.

the mini is for intelligent folk who want a small mp3 player. the nomad is for morons like you who don't like apple.

:fire
(the frog doesn't give a shit. wingnut is a moron.)

first off, the ipod mini is not strictly for intelligent people. in fact, id go so far to say that the majority of people buying them are unintelligent. why you ask? its a $250 4GB player, made by apple. now, for another $50, one can buy a regular 15GB ipod. so for $50, you gain 11GB of storage, and a nearly indistiguishable amount of size and weight. maybe when they come down in price it wont be so bad, but if you really want a color ipod, get a full size one painted. it costs about $50 from some website (i forgot the name, but it was featured on thechTV's TSS numerous times)

secondly, saying someone is a moron for paying a lower cost for a comparible product is obviously a farce. juse because someone doesnt agree with you doesnt mean that they are a moron because of it.

finally:

urbandictionary.com 's defintion of:

Troll - One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument

-and-

Fanboy - One with an extremely unintelligent bias.

[note: the following is adressed to everyone]

from this point on, may any use of those two words be supported not only by the definition given, but by proof that the accused actually fits the definition. in other words, if you dont want to be called a troll or a fanboy, dont do stuff that would likely get you accused of being a troll or a fanboy.

[wingnut2600]

...

Man, you diffused the tension in a beautiful and tactful manner and kept me from saying things that I might have been upset about in the morning.

:)

[isus]

wonderboy: the whole middle statement about ipod mini and noamd is sarcasm. i'm not saying he's a moron for paying less, i'm saying he's a moron for not just admitting he paid less for an inferior product. does it hold as much music as an ipod? yes. does apple spend millions in r&d each year? yes.

does creative spend millions on r&d? i would doubt it. a lot. is the nomad as 'sexy' as an ipod? no.

examples: nomad does eax. so? most headphones are of poor quality, so this feature is really just a shot in the dark by creative as it is an audio company (note: sb audigy). however, the ipod has more memory (32mb compared to 16mb). this shows a little thought on apple, as now they can make the ipod's battery smaller, as it will need to access the hard drive much less.

etc etc. i am done with this discussion. g'bye.

[wonderboy2005]

wonderboy: the whole middle statement about ipod mini and noamd is sarcasm. i'm not saying he's a moron for paying less, i'm saying he's a moron for not just admitting he paid less for an inferior product. does it hold as much music as an ipod? yes. does apple spend millions in r&d each year? yes.

does creative spend millions on r&d? i would doubt it. a lot. is the nomad as 'sexy' as an ipod? no.

examples: nomad does eax. so? most headphones are of poor quality, so this feature is really just a shot in the dark by creative as it is an audio company (note: sb audigy). however, the ipod has more memory (32mb compared to 16mb). this shows a little thought on apple, as now they can make the ipod's battery smaller, as it will need to access the hard drive much less.

etc etc. i am done with this discussion. g'bye.
to put it simply, both players have their positives and their negatives. as a result, no single player is ideal for everyone. can we all atleast agree on that?

[Sk8er Boi]

iPod's are amazing. Nuff said.

[MushroomheadXIII]

Yes the ease of the iPod, the style - by the ease i mean the extreme simplicity of the actual menu. I've operated both products and the zen touch is more advanced = easy for me but not for others because you have to get used to the drop down menus. The size is no issue, with the belt clip you hardly feel a thing. The design? Who TF cares about the design? Are you wanting to play music or look at the damn thing for the whole day? Zen does beat iPod - in my opinion. I own one but can honestly say i've tried both and i would turn down the iPod if i was offered one.

[FrozenShadow23]

I really hate creative. I bought their Live! 5.1 Soundblaster. It blows big time. I won't be buying another of their products any time soon.