Is It Stealing to Install P2P Apps, when U don't have money to buy them...!!!???

[Azo-999]

Is It stealing to Install P2P or other fileshared or xxx downloaded Apps, when U need them badly but don't have money to buy them?

This could be a good thread to talk about. So please tell Your opinions / habits / being 'onest / I've never dun that (lol) / police is knocking at my door just now....etc...

I've registered many apps at past 5 years, but only buyed some from on-line stores or local resellers. When having money for just to live (without beer), get my PC updated every 2 years and pay for ADSL and electricity (Daddy's not paying - I'm a daddy now). Am I a Criminal - are we all? Even when "stealing" some good music from FastTrack, that we cannot be able to buy. Are companies losing money (as they always say) in my case or Your case...?

I think they even can get more money, when I (or You) test a nice app and tell everyone how good it is - some of my friends have even paid for what I've recommented (those having job and money to do that)....

some Links : (Punish me hard if i'm not allowed to share these links here - or just click 'em and watch...)

http://NOWAREZLINKSAREALLOWED


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[TFoS_Fan]

Were not really stealing as audio cds that u download u probably would not buy on most occassions. If u really like the artist or group most people will buy the CD cause it looks nicer and is "cooler". Actually p2p helps the music industry as bands get wider recognised, people become big fans and buy more cds from different artist's and genres of music. Nu-metal is a prime example of how downloading populised groups and got them better cd sales.

[Azo-999]

Originally posted by TFoS_Fan
Were not really stealing as audio cds that u download u probably would not buy on most occassions.

What U said 'bout bands (especially the unknown / incoming ones) getting more fans all over the world and selling more records is really true.
It's sad that the "bigger" organizations are not understanding this fact (I guess the same thing is for many shareware producers too - when enough people D/L their apps, they are at some level getting more money if the app is good and if You as a registered user get more benefits. It's hard to find a new key / keygen all the time and having bad feeling "being a hacker / cracker".
Yes, most young people wants to be in with trends - so having a just-buyed record on Ur hands is something cool. When getting little older, it's not so "cool" anymore. Instead U can surprice Your friends (Not having PC and p2p) with a brand new self-made CD, which has not been even released Yet. Here in Finland it can take from weeks up to some months, before a Music (or Game) CD is released due to U.S releases.

[jona100]

If you download software, music, movies off P2P's that are not freeware, of course it is theft; there is no other way about it. Whether it is wrong depends on if you would have ever bought the product if you could not get hold of a copy off P2P. If so, P2P has essentially meant that the software/music/movie production company has lost revenue.

I am into 3D graphics and have downloaded many appz that costs 15K and above to buy legitimately, however due to the price I would never purchase the product and I do not intend to make a living out of 3D appz, so the software co's have not lost a penny they would have otherwise made.

I think most intelligent people (i.e. not the geeky 15 year olds thinking they are screwing "the man" who seem to populate these forums) know full this full well.

Personally, I feel there is no harm in it if I am never going to buy it or make money from its use any way, the production company’s are no worse off.

[Azo-999]

Originally posted by jona100
Re: Yes it is theft, but whether its is wrong depends...

That's really true - I and my brother use 3DStudio Max (Latest updatable Release - damn not buyed, it's from eDonkey - that piece of soft makes 15 K$+ or so, and both of us are Not using it so intensively that we should buy it - and not making any money of it, just for own fun....("Educational purposes, as they always say")


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[Canary]

This webpage article (http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/10.05/superuser.html) loses something from the original magazine print, nevertheless, some may enjoy it. :wings

[Rickio]

It's stealing so quit the discussion and get on with the downloading.

(though I feel it can have justification) but no one really cares. so keep on keeping on...


Peace!

[wonderboy2005]

first of all, dont get me wrong, i know that p2p isnt 'ethical'. with that being said, here is my opinion.

stealing is when somone looses somthing that they rightfully owned. so if i am poor, and dont have a couple big ones to throw around, adobe isnt going to get any money from me via photoshop. so they arent loosing anything, when i get it via p2p. so for me it boils down to this: if you can afford it, but you dont 'buy' it, its stealing. if you cant afford it, and you dont 'buy' it, its not. thats just my opinion. not neccesarilly right. but its right in my opinion.

[TwoZigzagColt45]

bit of a silly question reallyhttp://www.imagemagician.com/images/twozigzagcolt45/banghead[1].gif

of course its stealing

but
as long as you dont do it for finacial gain then its only petty theft

I can live with that

http://www.imagemagician.com/images/twozigzagcolt45/smokin[1].gif

[Azo-999]

Originally posted by TwoZigzagColt45
of course its stealing
This Silly Question was intented to be just a subject for talking, not as a question. Of cource I know what's stealing and i'm also Not making any money with that "virtual property", that I own. I think that bigger stealers are our leaders anf führers and they don't even have bad conscience of their doings.
I can live with my bits on my HD's and CDR's, they will never do any harm to anybody (sometimes my son doesn't like when I listen to that 70's show from Slade to Pink Floyd, but mostly I listen to nowadays music, because it's simply good, electronic and fresh)...
If I should start a Russian mafia-style CD-Factory to make money with unpublished CD's, that would be a crime, but it has never came further from my brains. I don't like hazardous life - simplier is just to enjoy what U got (and get more) AND SHARE what U got.
I'm not a leecher - their direction is always to have and have more - that's quite egoistic thinkin'....

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[PatientSaint]

hmmmm well if u are talking app or games that i have gotten without paying you could say that's stealing or maybe the people i have gotten it from actually have taken that whole those who care share motto my mom said when i was young. So in a sense peopel are learning to share ! now if we could learn to share land.......world would be a better place.

As for Music....music is for everyone you're not going into stores an shop lifting. Do the artists mind that you are listening to thier music? look around on the net for thier opinions. Most are happy that people are out enjoying music. Music is such a spiritual experince we should have to pay out our wallets as the RIAA would have. They charge us with stealing....what would you call how mcuh they rip artists? have you read about contracts? Also someone pointed out for al lthose Cds an tapes we bought long ago tha the RIAA refusedto let singles out on so we had to buy the CD for one or two songs that were really worth it an the rest sucked. We're recouping that loss now lol

Anyway it's all about perspective an keepin an open view.In the end if you truely feel yo uare stealing well then if you feel so bad stop :P

[Killawat]

Well i'm not really "stealing"
I get my goods from my friends work
They Have enough licenses to support my whole neighborhood
and they don't even use them all
so i guess its not
is it?
and they know i do it
they "support" it
so i mean
it can't be that bad

[Azo-999]

When talking in forums like this, nothing is stealing - it's just borrowing, licencing, makin' bands a favor, suckin' RIAA, supporting xxx-sites pop-ups etc...

So let it go, men - let's keep on "borrowing" - not for just collecting, but using them, AND NOT makin' bucks outta them
(to supporting good music and shareware by "our ways")

Now a few pirate Marks :

:cross :cross :cross :cross

[Juggalo15]

If you can't afford a application i guess it would be ok.lol,but most people are rich and just say they cant afford them,which is really cheap.:cross

[Azo-999]

Originally posted by Juggalo15
If you can't afford a application i guess it would be ok.lol,but most people are rich and just say they cant afford them,which is really cheap.:cross
Yes - I'm not rich. Retired by heart-related reasons 3 years ago with a small pension and need even Social Security Office's help to get throuh da worst monhs. But for da Rich I say : U R stealing just to be greedy. If having an American Dream (2-floor big house with white fences over big yard and new sports-car in garage) then U really suck stealin' especially when concidering shareware (who's makers are mostly not very rich, but they also have a vision like the "American Dream")
(unless all Your staff is loaned from bank and U have just been fired)

I do NOT blame anyone, because that's not my job here. Do whatever, but learn to care, feel pity, open Your hearts and sometimes GIVE out something for poor people - U'll notice, that it'll bring U a very much different feeling of joy, than driving a KnighRiders car and lookin for Girl's asses and thinkin' that the pole at Ur stomach is da center of da Universe.

A bit long said, but got my point?

Peace ! Share h2o & p2p, land and minds !

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[whiff]

Unless the media or application you're sharing or downloading is a) in the public domain, b) freeware/shareware or c) authorized for promotional distribution, then sharing the file or taking the file is theft. Pure and Simple. Repeat: It's stealing, just like taking candy from a baby. Why do you think they call copying CDs "ripping"???

Is stealing wrong? Depends on your ethical framework (if any). If you are a capitalist or libertarian, or if you adhere to some kind of judeo/christian/islamic belief system, then it's pretty clear. Stealing would be wrong. Attention all religion believers: P2P=Satan.

If you're poor and you want something you can't afford (like Photoshop), you're not allowed to just take it. You're supposed to suffer and make do without it. It makes you a better person, right?

On the other hand, if you are an anarchist, communist or socialist then you probably believe that property is theft, and therefore appropriating and re-distributing intellectual property is A-OK. P2P=Robin Hood. Of course the contents that are generally being traded on p2p (porn, videogames, pop tunes, movies) are nothing but bourgeois brainwashing - if you want this kind of crap you're just a closet reactionary , and if you're stealing it you're a confused little dilletante.

I hope that clarifies things. Now go do some crimes, like eat sushi and not pay.

[whiff]

that most of the posters on this thread are exhibiting serious ethical deficiency or abject confusion about beliefs vs. actions. To say that its stealing but its OK because I don't make money on it, or it's OK because its just petty theft, or its actually good for the victim, means you think what you're doing is wrong, but you're grasping at flimsy justifications to try to make it right. Talk about guilt issues - ya'll are heading straight for psychotherapy.

I'm amazed that nobody here has the temerity to come out and say that crapitalism is wrong, our society is wrong, and stealing what we want and giving it away is an extremely just and sensible activity.

[Azo-999]

Originally posted by whiff

OK: - (whiff) -
- Capitalism is wrong, our society is wrong, and stealing what we want and giving it away is an extremely just and sensible activity.
- Communism and Socialism is wrong, still acts as oligarchic powers.
- Islamers and Cristians are wrong - also oligarchy and inner circles leading the community
- Market Economy is Most wrong of all - a Huge Company can after a few years buy an indebted country from Africa to get cheap workmanship for their greedy means of maximum benefits (to the leaders mostly)
- And finally : all the rest is wrong, because of human beings who finally by some way once got this planet under their asses still not being long evolved from the monkeys.
- Selfishness, greed, hate, angst, angriness, jealousy, envyness, and most of the 7 sins of death are wrong and still makes the world merrygoround towards it's final goal : The End!
- BUT, we still have time to change and giving, that goes from our hearts is a beginning - I personally let us feel a little hope that still one day people have a Soul, Not only "The Brains".

Underneath of the upper Big Deals is our little moral discussion, that conciders only one BillionPart of the whole truth.
This kinda "I'm feeling bad/mad of this specific thing" is a needle in haystack - still taking so much resources outta our everyday living.

P.S. Isn't it a fact, that a bank-robber gets more cake than cold-blooded murderer. That's our (leaders) opinition, which is more important : i.e. Money or a human soul...

Peace! Now and Forever - Give and share what U got - That's OK!

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[Rickio]

a lot of things can can or should be said are often not. at least here by me as I know my ideas as a few others here can note, their ideas also will be lost.

but modern society is mostly all wrong.

ok it's said.

not picking on calptialism I am picking on the whole ball of crap.

instead tell me what's right and let's try and make it better.


Peace!