Poll: Forum "Tree" Layout

[smokingbevel]

It would seem that the forums interface has a layout and navigation sequence of:
list of forums categories
...list of threads in forum category (paged)
......list of posts in thread in forum category (paged, with layout options)
Here, surprisingly enough, to some, the user may be better served by a static navigational load-on-expand, collapsable "tree" layout, where "clicked-on" node elements open in an alternate, delegated location, frame, or window.
Optionally, dynamic "refresh" updates may be possible.
While this is a personal request of convenience, if such a request is in the interests of the people, then perhaps it has a greater chance of being heard and met.
Thus, employment of a democratic device is attempted here.
(Note: implementation of such a request is not considered by the author to be very difficult, as he, himself, in theory, could implement such.)

[begoodbebad]

It's worth trying. ZP has an odd format, with the news page having so much prominence and importance but without the forums being secondary in any way...most places have a distinct emphasis on one or the other or they are more focused on a narrower range of subjects....p2p seems to ultimately connect to every other aspect of geekdom in important ways....so maybe what we have now is not as clumsy as it seems at first....but still a change wouldn't hurt and it might be a big improvement...I'm trying to imagine it but maybe the best way is to just do it and see how it goes. You get my vote.

[cjules13]

Isn't the threaded mode for display close enough? I didn't see the ability to "collapse" any threads, but I guess I see what your saying... That makes it possible to have two different subtopics at the same time... but usually a new thread is started. Not a bad plan, but I bet they want to try out this new format for awhile and get it worn in a little...

[Sephiroth]

Im not sure i get the idea but it seems kinda similar to what slashdot uses expect it would load in a specific window or location. Which i dont think that it can be done through the forum software or would take too much time.

And isnt a easy thing to do, to get the changes to the layout it took about a month and a half of planning actually coming up with something that is generally accepted by everyone and a while to actually get it in place.

[vipp]

I'm just happy to see they fixed it so now we can see what forum we are in.

[smokingbevel]

Well, this somewhat predictable. A major segment of this democratic experiment is being flushed, partially due to the inclusion of redundant "Null" options, which could have been represented implicitly by vote omission. Regardless, I'd still rather have the "Null" votes than omissions.
Now for a bit of clarification. A vote for "Yea", signifies a desire for a one-page display of something similar to
forum category
...forum thread00
......thread00 post00 segment
......thread00 post01 segment
...forum thread01
in navigational tree layout form, with collapsable nodes. Clicks of nodes in the navigational window either open or replace the view in the other "detail" window. The data (or model) itself already implies this sort of structuring, but currently, the views only partially reflect this ordering. After researching the vBulletin software and it's documentation briefly, I have noted that modifications of this nature are doable, but create a number of complexities. Obviously, many seemingly insurmountable obstacles may arise which restrict updates of this nature. Primarily, this was, and is a small-model democratic experiment, designed with the objective of ascertaining whether change can be instigated by the people served by a service. Unfortunately, the backbone of the process is somewhat flawed by the magnitude and specifics in the goal of the actual mutation itself.

[baghdad_steve15]

Its called threaded view and ZP already has it (EDIT: some sort of it). Change it under Display Modes.

[smokingbevel]

That's a big negative, baghdad_steve15. I consider the "Threaded", "Hybrid" and "Linear" modes to be "post display" options only. I'm referring to a vaguely similar navigational extension which encompasses forum category, forum, threads, and optionally, post segments and wraps these elements in a tree hiearchy.
Given that this site is quite notable and reputable, I had expected that a "Tree Layout" option existed, and thus, prior to this, at present, mediocre activity, I attempted to locate and activate it.
An incomplete and dated mock-up is presented for clarification:
New Users
...File Sharing Questions
......Sticky: Beginners Guide to p2ping! [Malicious Intent]
.........[optional]post segment00
.........[optional]post segment01
Peer-2-Peer (collapsed)
General Discussion
...Spyware & Adware (collapsed)
...P2P Politics
......Announcement: Forum Rules [Sephiroth]
.........[optional]post segment00
.........[optional]post segment01
.........""
......A heritical view of file sharing [Mike Hunt]
...General Computing(collapsed)

[Sephiroth]

I dont think that vbulletin can do that, i havent seen anything like that on any vbulletin forum.

[AbercrombieDave]

i think the old layout was better (think last year...maybe 2002 as well).

the new one has a fruity layout and color scheme and i dont like the rating thing (the most agreed post goes on top). i'd rather see posts chronologically happen.

[smokingbevel]

AbercrombieDave, if you feel strongly that the users and the overall site will benefit from the changes you mentioned, and don't mind the possibility that you may appear to be whiny, anal retentive, or a meddler in instigating such things, you are encouraged to spawn your own "democratic experiment". By all means, go forth and attempt to install change by vote.
Note: expect to fail miserably while receiving negative blows to public perception rating

[Sephiroth]

i think the old layout was better (think last year...maybe 2002 as well).

the new one has a fruity layout and color scheme and i dont like the rating thing (the most agreed post goes on top). i'd rather see posts chronologically happen.

Posts are chronologically for me.. my thread display is linear- oldest first you should probably check the options in the control panel and see if its something different.

The colors are the same as they are on the front page. The layout was done to reduce redundent forums which there were many clones because people kept requesting new forums that have the same purpose as numerous others. Many people did not post in the right forum and so the subforum were mainly scrapped so that those previous sub forums would be more noticeable and people would post in the right forum.

Which is why it had to be changed and its really a good thing which should make things much less confusing, more orgainzed, and adding, removing forums to meet the demands of the community is much easier to do.



AbercrombieDave, if you feel strongly that the users and the overall site will benefit from the changes you mentioned, and don't mind the possibility that you may appear to be whiny, anal retentive, or a meddler in instigating such things, you are encouraged to spawn your own "democratic experiment". By all means, go forth and attempt to install change by vote.
Note: expect to fail miserably while receiving negative blows to public perception rating

This is not a government here, certainly not a democracy, this is a web forum. There is no need to make things that complicated, plus it just doesnt work well in this situation, its extreeme inefficient, and has many loopholes and vurnablities that can be exploited by troublemakers.

The best way is to simply just ask, not demand, not troll as some other people here have tried to do, that will get you ignored. As ive mentioned twice in the past in this thread as for this idea, it cant be done on vbulletin at this time. So what do you want me to tell you. Do you want me to lie to you or something?

Second its a huge change to change the entire structure of the forums, to something completely different and unique from every other forum on the internet, plus i dont think many people here would go for such a huge change in thing especially the admins.

[smokingbevel]

This is not a government here, certainly not a democracy, this is a web forum.Any service which continually refuses to meet the important requests of the bulk of its people, will probably be replaced by an alternate service which listens.
Leaders of a service who do not realize that it is the people served who ultimately hold reins of power over the service's success or failure, will either be replaced, or damn the service to failure. Frankly, I am quite frustrated with the apparent attitude exhibited by some producers and providers, who never take in to account the real demands of users or consumers of products and services. User feedback and conceptualization should be encouraged, not roadblocked (by a chain of command).

As ive mentioned twice in the past in this thread as for this idea, it cant be done on vbulletin at this time.Wow. Perhaps a storebrand, beta, thrift-shop, ripped version of the software is in use. The vBulletin documentation is misleading, as it seems to suggest that the software is very flexible.

Do you want me to lie to you or something?"Yes, by all means, keep lying."

to something different and unique from every other forum on the internet"Stand clear. If you're branded a pioneer, your could be immortalized in a textbook."

plus i dont think many people here would go for such a huge change in thing especially the admins.I merely observed one obvious defect, or flaw, which I believed, when remedied in the proper manner, would strengthen the site against all other competition.
Given an admin's princely financial compensation, such tasks pertaining to improvement, if seemingly difficult, should be refused outright.
Unless a greater number of users demonstrate something other than disinterest, there is no need to foolishly press this issue further.

Contary to what some may claim, Sephiroth, you do have a reasonable measure of patience, and are capable of extended politeness and decency.
I thankyou for that.

[Sephiroth]

Any service which continually refuses to meet the important requests of the bulk of its people, will probably be replaced by an alternate service which listens.
Leaders of a service who do not realize that it is the people served who ultimately hold reins of power over the service's success or failure, will either be replaced, or damn the service to failure. Frankly, I am quite frustrated with the apparent attitude exhibited by some producers and providers, who never take in to account the real demands of users or consumers of products and services. User feedback and conceptualization should be encouraged, not roadblocked (by a chain of command).


Wow. Perhaps a storebrand, beta, thrift-shop, ripped version of the software is in use. The vBulletin documentation is misleading, as it seems to suggest that the software is very flexible.


Yes but one has to listen to everyone and not just one person. You are not representative of everyone here, so its odd that someone that as new as you seem to know alot about this place.

Your idea would require alot of hacking of the vbulletin software which again if its even possible and again i doubt that the admins would spend many hours coding in something like this just to talior the forum layout to your personal needs that not everyone would like and would just be confusing and complicating things even more than neccessary.

Especially since you were banned in the past and you will continued to be rebanned.

[smokingbevel01]

Especially since you were banned in the past and you will continued to be rebannedYou have drawn inaccurate conclusions about my identity here. In fact, prior to this incident, it would not be possible for the identity to be "rebanned", as I had never been "banned" from any service before.

Yes but one has to listen to everyone and not just one person. You are not representative of everyone here, so its odd that someone that as new as you seem to know alot about this place. I have not claimed, nor do I believe that any one user alone should have the power to dictate implementation of services for the remaining user body. There is clearly a misinterpretation here, although, I attempt to express such clearly in the following:

Unless a greater number of users demonstrate something other than disinterest, there is no need to foolishly press this issue further.Please refer to the poll at the top of the page. It should be noted, that while I have spawned a few clone identities in an attempt at a defense, I haven't used opportunities to "fix" the poll by applying additional votes in favor of change. This is evidence that I do not believe changes should be brought about by my request only.
I reiterate that, while this identity is clearly a clone, the identity "smokingbevel" is not, as I am, in reality, "new" to the site. While the tone of what I previously posted may be construed as unnecessarily "harsh", I still believe that the absolute eternal banishment from the site, is unjustified without at least some degree of warning. When spawning this thread, I, in no way, intended that conflicts with a mod would arise, and result in banishment for all eternity without reasonable provocation or respectable warning. In short, I've been completely banished from the site, for mere suggestions, the continued defense of these suggestions, and misunderstandings concerning the history of my identity. I dont' consider the proliferation of clone identities to be an act of decency on my part, so currently, I humbly appeal to you, Sephiroth, to reinstate the original identity "smokingbevel". In exchange, in the future, I'll be more careful about the decisions I make, and distinctly avoid prolonged conflicts of interests. It is in your power, to terminate this perpetuating game, before it reaches new immutable levels of mediocrity.

[Sephiroth]

Fine, dont cause any problems. For the most part ive mainly been trying to explain things, and i dont even have access to make changes to the forums at all. From my experiance its not an easy thing to be done, and you can have all the polls you want but it doesnt matter if you cant get the admins to agree to do it because the ultimate decision is theirs. Your idea wasnt that clear in what it would do either.

[smokingbevel]

Thankyou Sephiroth.