protection?

[isus]

if limiting your bandwidth meant protection from the riaa/mpaa, would you do it? and how far?

i think i would do it to about 50kB/s, bc that's 2 192kbps mp3's, at real time transfers. if you can't wait 4 minutes, for a 4 minute mp3, then... i dunno...

but what would you do about movies? software/iso's?

[ATLien]

Sound reasonable, to me. Anything to discourage, "Hillary and the Gang" from an easy task of messing with the F.S.C.(that's "file sharing community", for the newbies out there).

[rainbowdemon]

Does this actually work? If it does then I'm in good shape! I am on a 28k dial-up already. Yes I know this sucks real hard, but because I live in a very rural area this is all that is available. So there may be a bright side to this after all!:fire

[Wings_of_Azrael]

How would that help? Or is this a 100% hypothetical question? I'm just wondering if there is some way that the RIAA could pin point users based on speed. I suppose they'd have to have access to ISP's logs to accomplish that on a large scale. Anyway, people might as well go full speed. The RIAA would just have to spot out a user from a mass of d/lers going at full throttle instead of a mass of d/lers going at half speed.

My semi-solution is just to stay on a network while I'm d/ling what I need. I'm not trying to run a friggin' file server or anything. There's no need to stay connected to any network for days at a time unless I'm d/ling large files from ed2k.

[downloadalot]

Originally posted by Wings_of_Azrael
How would that help? Or is this a 100% hypothetical question? I'm just wondering if there is some way that the RIAA could pin point users based on speed. I suppose they'd have to have access to ISP's logs to accomplish that on a large scale. Anyway, people might as well go full speed. The RIAA would just have to spot out a user from a mass of d/lers going at full throttle instead of a mass of d/lers going at half speed.

My semi-solution is just to stay on a network while I'm d/ling what I need. I'm not trying to run a friggin' file server or anything. There's no need to stay connected to any network for days at a time unless I'm d/ling large files from ed2k.

I think isus was thinking of running through a proxy to cover your ip adress. Then it would result indeed, in lower dl speeds.

[isus]

no to the proxy server...

i was just wondering, bc think about a college network. if they (anybody looking at logs) see huge ass spikes of bandwidth going straight to your comp, they are gonna suspect you...

so if you used shareaza's, or winmx's bandwidth throttle, you could make the bandwidth look not-as-bad.

the only way to cover our asses would be:
a. run perrguardian or another ip blocker
b. be a leech so that any new ip's cannot tell we are sharing files
c. run a heavy firewall
d. use encryption a la filetopia.

[ATLien]

Yea, but what about data? Now business and colleges are looking at the amount of data i.e. information, traveling threw the networks, as a "tell tell" sign of file sharing.

[eivioolla]

I don't think bandwidth limiting helps in any way with RIAA but it definately helps with university network admins. What they care about is that Uni network can be used for what is meant for, they don't really care wtf you're doing if you keep it at reasonable level and they don't get specific complaints from RIAA about you.

I have daily transfer limits so I have to do bandwidth limiting to be able to share at all otherwise the amounts would get out of hand really quickly on a 10/100Mbps.

Oh and about your ass covering list, none of that is really any use. If you want to do public sharing then any protection scheme must start from hiding your IP address one way or another. If you don't do that, then anything else like encryption etc will be rendered as useless.

[Wings_of_Azrael]

Originally posted by eivioolla
I don't think bandwidth limiting helps in any way with RIAA but it definately helps with university network admins. What they care about is that Uni network can be used for what is meant for, they don't really care wtf you're doing if you keep it at reasonable level and they don't get specific complaints from RIAA about you.


Yeah, that's why my old school blocked P2P altogether.

[isus]

iw as just reading an article in the paper about file sharing... how one school limits bandwidth for file sharing apps. they save $25000 a year ($75000 now, from $100000 a bit ago). so if you share the university/school a bunch of money, they won't care...

the particular college also said that they see legitimate uses for p2p, like music for class presentations, etc... so they dont wanna get rid of p2p altogether.

source: the daily times, may 10, www.delmarvanow.com

[Theinfamousone]

How does encryption in filetopia help? They can't encrypt your IP.

It's all about everyone proxying to one another like in freenet. It's slow, but what are you gonna do?

[eivioolla]

Actually it even isn't that slow. Requests are slow yes, but when the transfer starts, if the file is popular then it's actually pretty fast. I downloaded some tv series episode from Freenet just today and got speeds between 100-200kB/s. I think it's actually pretty much like BitTorrent, it's fast for new and popular stuff but older stuff drops out and becomes unavailable.

[isus]

Originally posted by Theinfamousone
How does encryption in filetopia help? They can't encrypt your IP.

but filetopia encrypts everything else.

and there is a law, some obscure little law... that says if you hack a secure connection, its a breach of federal law. so if the riaa catches you on filetopia, hacks through all the encryption, and sees you sharing mass amounts of mp3's, they really can't do anything about it.

the evidence of you sharing files would be dismissed bc the evidence was gained through illegal means.

[eivioolla]

You are wrong. Look, they don't need to hack encryption because you are showing your IP address. I give you an example. Let's say I wanna make some money and I contact one of the companies that bust p2pers for RIAA and tell them that I can start busting Filetopia users.

I would start Filetopia, do a search for a new movie or a song, let's say LOTR for example. I would then start downloading one. I'd dowload a few megs or whatever amount is enough for solid proof that it is the actual file. I would record the time, check your IP with netstat or some more sophisticated network analyzer, filename, filesize and the hash value if it was available. I'd then find out what ISP owns that IP and send them a complaint with the above info.

-Encryptions broken: 0
-How much did your firewall do you any good?
-How much did peerguardian help you?

[method]

What if the IP of the FileTopia user was actually the IP of a 'bouncer'??

[CCSDUDE]

This is how bored I get on Sunday's.....god they suck....

[eivioolla]

Originally posted by method
What if the IP of the FileTopia user was actually the IP of a 'bouncer'??

I used FileTopia for a long time. I tried to ask if anyone knew about bouncer addresses I could use. Nobody ever answered. So, if and that is a BIG if you indeed used a bouncer that is untraceable to you then yes I would have wrong IP. The problem with the idea of a bouncer is that it's very unlikely anyone would keep a public bouncer for free. That's why Freenet works better because everyone is 'bouncing' everyone else or ES5 that uses standard http/https protocols so it can use the proxies that already exists to bounce the traffic.

[isus]

Originally posted by method
What if the IP of the FileTopia user was actually the IP of a 'bouncer'??

i dunno... i think meth has a good point... but im not sure if filetopia encodes ip's or not...

hey meth, are you still expecting to continue work on xnet this summer? it was a great prog, i hope you do :)

[eivioolla]

Nothing 'encodes' (wtf?) IP. Bouncer in this case means FileTopia specific proxy, that relays FileTopia traffic.

No offence but I think people should study a bit about networking if they want to take part in these discussions. For example I see a lot of people keep on saying things like "get a good firewall!!!!", yet I get a feeling that half of them has no idea what a fw does... And that goes to lot of other things as well.

[isus]

Originally posted by eivioolla
Nothing 'encodes' (wtf?) IP. Bouncer in this case means FileTopia specific proxy, that relays FileTopia traffic.

encodes > encrypts... sorry, my bad... that's what i meant.

hmm... well... yea... i just thought the idea thru, and realized why it didnt work... haha, sry

[eivioolla]

No problem, I'm fully aware that not everybody can have a PhD in communications, sometimes people just seem to have funny ideas what can and can not be done. IP is Internet Protocol so if you want to use Internet, that's what you use and address is a fundamental part of it. It's quite analog to regular postal system, there is a strict protocol how to define the receiver (and in IP the sender too), if you try something funny you can be quite sure that the post office (first router) will throw your message to trash can.

[isus]

yea...

i dunno what i was thinking... *shrug*

[method]

Isus... yes..

and I'll try to make p2p anonymity a lot quicker and more useable than freenet and filetopia. but i don't wanna say more for now... got good plans tho. nuff said n peace!! :;)

[isus]

Originally posted by method
Isus... yes..

and I'll try to make p2p anonymity a lot quicker and more useable than freenet and filetopia. but i don't wanna say more for now... got good plans tho. nuff said n peace!! :;)

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!

oh, and did i mention,

THANK YOU